[Paniolo]

Hopefully I've done this right and the picture of my attempt at a knotted ridge lashing shows up somewhere in this post. This is my first posting since joining the forum and I'm fairly new at bone carving so forgive me if I haven't got everything right yet. I did my best to create a knotted ridge lashing following the instructions in the Myhre book as best I could. As you can see, my knotted ridge ended up looking more like a bi-directional wrap than a ridge. For any members who have mastered this lashing technique, is there actually a knot involved with each wrap and if so, what sort of knot is it? The illustration in the Myhre book doesn't seem to indicate an actual knot at each wrap but somehow the knot magically appears in the photos at the end of the job! Can anyone share that magic with me?

[Janel]

Good luck with the lashing, I am not able to help with that. You did manage to post a photo, but please read the topic at the top of each forum area regarding photo size guidelines.

Janel

[Brent Duty]

This guy posted this sketch of a knotted ridge. Pretty good drawing to, Hope this helps.

http://radio.weblogs.com/0128644/categorie...06/02.html#a999

[Janel]

Hi Paniolo,

Thanks for resizing your photo. It helps. I wonder if while you were doing the lashing if you were untwisting the twist of the cord, or is the cord that you were using a flat cord, or loosely twisted to begin with? Having a look at the link that Brent posted above, the CoffeeWaffle cord looks a bit untwisted too. The photos and illustrations on that blog look like really helpful instructions. I hope that they help you figure it out!

Janel

[Irishcarver]

Hey Paniolo.

I'm new to carving too and I'm trying to work out all about these traditional style lashings. What material did you use? I've been looking around and found that waxed braid or beeswax nylon is what seems to be the best. Your lashings look good, have you found anything that shows how to do the ones i the picture i have attached. It seems to be a hard topic to find out about.
All the best,
Damien

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[Paniolo]

Thank you all for your suggestions.

The sketch of the knotted ridge on the Coffee Waffle blog actually came from the Myhre book on carving, which I have and used to try the lashing that I posted. I'm still missing something but can't figure out what. I did leave a note for the author of the Coffee Waffle blog but didn't receive a reply.

Damien, I was fortunate enough to learn how to do the lashing you're trying to do by watching a video posted on kettlebottom.com by a carver in Hawaii called Louie the Fish. He showed on the video how to do that lashing. I've been at it for about 9 months now and only a few of the lashings I've done are passable, but I'm getting there. I'd love to be able to refer you to that video but one day it just vanished. There is an abridged version of it still available on kettlebottom if you go to: http://kettlebottom.com/videos/web-only/bo...ged-version/247. The unabridged video was a lifesaver for me because I've never seen it explained elsewhere, other than the Myhre book which seems to me to be incomplete. Also, the lashing in the photo you posted allows the carving to move on the cord. The Myhre method does not. It's a real shame that video was pulled because I think it helped a lot of beginners like us to get into this hobby.

Regarding the material I use for lashing, it looks like the material in the photo you have and I have also used is 3 ply waxed nylon. I buy mine from www.jewelsinfiber.com. Very reasonable prices and quality material. I actually prefer to use waxed braid that I buy via the Internet from a shop in New Zealand. I believe, however, that Tandy Leather also sells a similar product. The waxed braid is a little easier to use and leaves a cleaner looking lash. Like I said, I've been trying to learn how to lash properly for 9 months and I'll usually lash a carving four or five times before it looks even passable. I still haven't been able to do one as clean as the one in the picture you posted. I'm assuming that comes with time and practice, so I keep practicing.

If I can think of a way to share my limited knowledge of lashing with you I will. If you have any ideas I'd be open to them as well. I'm not really tech-savvy and don't have a lot of fancy cameras, etc. I do have a digital camera but I don't think I could take enough pictures to make the lashing process understandable. It's much better to see the process done from beginning to end. Perhaps someone else will have an idea. There are lots of very talented people on this forum.

[Irishcarver]

Thanks Paniolo.

I definitely try to locate that video. Waxed braid is what I was thinking about alright. I've seen a few places on the net that sells it. I'll also try the other suggestions too. I did a knot that I found on youtube for tying lanyards on my last one and it looks pretty cool. Its the one on the right on the pic that I posted. This forum is definitely a great tool for learning. I'll let you know if I find any other info.

Regards,
Damien

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[Paniolo]

Those are some nice hooks Damien. Do you use a Dremel or manual gravers to engrave the detail on the hooks?

Where are you physically located? I see it says California on your information. What part of California?

Louie the Fish recently posted pictures of some of his new work on tikicentral.com. I don't know if it would do any good to maybe try to appeal to him to re-post his lashing video. He seems like a reasonable guy and I don't think hobbyists like us pose any threat to his business so he may just be sympathetic to your/our plight.

[Irishcarver]

I actually asked on that thread the last to see if he would do that. Hopefully he might. If not I may have to go to Hawaii or New Zealand to find out, which wouldn't be the worst thing in the world!! I'm in Bakersfield at the moment, temporarily here with work. I'd much rather be closer to a beach but it'll do for now. I use a dremel mainly because it was all I had. I just got a set of files which are nice for some extra detailing. I cant wait until I can build my own little workshop/station.
I guess we'll just have to keep on the trail of the elusive lashing/binding instructions and tutorials!

Take care

Damien

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[Janel]

There are threads on TCP that show our benches and our benches in action. Have you found those threads yet? It may offer some clues for how we each find a way to work on our small sized things.

Janel

[Paniolo]

Irishcarver, on May 19 2009, 07:17 PM, said:

I actually asked on that thread the last to see if he would do that. Hopefully he might. If not I may have to go to Hawaii or New Zealand to find out, which wouldn't be the worst thing in the world!! I'm in Bakersfield at the moment, temporarily here with work. I'd much rather be closer to a beach but it'll do for now. I use a dremel mainly because it was all I had. I just got a set of files which are nice for some extra detailing. I cant wait until I can build my own little workshop/station.
I guess we'll just have to keep on the trail of the elusive lashing/binding instructions and tutorials!

Take care

Damien

Damien, I'm in Arizona so you're a lot closer to the beach than I am! The reason I asked was because I occasionally have reason to travel to the San Fran Bay Area for business or to visit family that lives there. If you were in the vicinity I would have been happy to have met you and shown you what I've learned so far.

I asked Louie the Fish in an e-mail if he would consider having a workshop for people like us to learn bone carving and lashing the right way but I never received a reply. There is a guy in NZ that does week-long or longer workshops on bone carving but Hawaii would be a lot easier, not to mention cheaper, for those of us in the western U.S. I hope someone out there will be kind enough to post some lashing tutorials for all of us beginners. Until then we'll have to do as you say and keep on the trail.

Paul

[Irishcarver]

Hey Paniolo,

Its been a while. I see that there is a new kiwi that has just joined on the forum. I sent him a message because he said he does lashings. Hopefully he'll be able to shed some light on the situation for us. I've started doing some lashings that create a knot on each side. I'll try and make a tutorial or something. Its pretty easy and looks well. I found artificial sinew in Michael's (craft store) and it is nice to work with. Its already waxed too and knots really nicely because it is flat and realy workable.
Got some antler today from a friend so that should be fun. Also got some soft stone but I cant think of the name right now.

Take care,

Damien

[Novice Carver]

Irishcarver, on Jun 15 2009, 09:09 PM, said:

Hey Paniolo,

Its been a while. I see that there is a new kiwi that has just joined on the forum. I sent him a message because he said he does lashings. Hopefully he'll be able to shed some light on the situation for us. I've started doing some lashings that create a knot on each side. I'll try and make a tutorial or something. Its pretty easy and looks well. I found artificial sinew in Michael's (craft store) and it is nice to work with. Its already waxed too and knots really nicely because it is flat and realy workable.
Got some antler today from a friend so that should be fun. Also got some soft stone but I cant think of the name right now.

Take care,

Damien

Hey Irish,

I'm new to this forum myself and have only recently started carving bone while traveling New Zealand. I've searched lots for resources and as I'm sure you have experienced they are not easy to find. I was fortunate however to have another carver suggest Stephen Myhre's book on Bone carving. It has that hook lashing you are looking for and a couple others. Best investment I have made for my carving yet.

[Paniolo]

Irishcarver, on Jun 16 2009, 03:09 AM, said:

Hey Paniolo,

Its been a while. I see that there is a new kiwi that has just joined on the forum. I sent him a message because he said he does lashings. Hopefully he'll be able to shed some light on the situation for us. I've started doing some lashings that create a knot on each side. I'll try and make a tutorial or something. Its pretty easy and looks well. I found artificial sinew in Michael's (craft store) and it is nice to work with. Its already waxed too and knots really nicely because it is flat and realy workable.
Got some antler today from a friend so that should be fun. Also got some soft stone but I cant think of the name right now.

Take care,

Damien

Hi Damien,

That's a nice looking knot you've come up with. Is that original or did you find instructions somewhere?

I buy all my artificial sinew from vendors on eBay. Good price and good quality. Just got a bunch in dark brown from a shoe manufacturer in Canada. I'm still using heavy 3 ply waxed nylon from jewelsinfiber.com for the actual lashing.

Do you make your own bone toggles for the cord? I do but I must admit that mine don't look as good as yours do. I cut a groove in mine and wrap the cord around it, then keep it all together with waxed nylon whipping.

I hope you hear from the new carver with lashing experience. I just ordered a CD ROM about bone carving from a guy in New Zealand -- kiwibone.com. I don't know if it will have any information about lashing on it, but if it helps me better learn to carve with gravers and hand tools it will be worth it. I'll let you know if there is any lashing information on it once I receive it.

Paul (Paniolo)

[Irishcarver]

Hey Paul.

Yeah I was talking to that guy, his name is Billy. Go over to the Who's Who section and look at the new kiwi on board thread. He posted some of his stuff up there. Its awesome. He posted some stuff on his lashings too. He said he would try and make a video to help us out which would be sweet. That knot that you like, was that on the picture up further on this thread? I'll do some pictures of this new binding that I'm doing too and make a little video tutorial. It looks really tidy when you use the artificial sinew!!

Speak to you soon,

Damien

[Paniolo]

Irishcarver, on Jun 19 2009, 01:34 AM, said:

Hey Paul.

Yeah I was talking to that guy, his name is Billy. Go over to the Who's Who section and look at the new kiwi on board thread. He posted some of his stuff up there. Its awesome. He posted some stuff on his lashings too. He said he would try and make a video to help us out which would be sweet. That knot that you like, was that on the picture up further on this thread? I'll do some pictures of this new binding that I'm doing too and make a little video tutorial. It looks really tidy when you use the artificial sinew!!

Speak to you soon,

Damien

Hi Damien,

I went over to the Who's Who section yesterday and saw the thread from the new kiwi. Take a look at www.kiwibone.com as well to see some intricate, fascinating carvings. I'm hoping his carving CD ROM will help me make my etching a little cleaner. I have tried both gravers and the rotary tool with etching burrs and still get uneven, rough and pitted lines. Perhaps it's a matter of practice but I also think technique, or my lack of it, has a lot to do with it.

Yes, the knot I was referring to was on the latest picture that you posted. That makes a nice, clean, interesting finish. I think it's funny that so many people refer me/us to the Myhre book, which I've looked at until my head hurts. Perhaps I'm just thick but I can't seem to fill in the blanks between those knot tying picture steps. I watched Louie the Fish lash on a video, though, and I could do it. I hope Billy comes through with that video sometime soon!

Paul

[Janel]

Hi Paul,

"I have tried both gravers and the rotary tool with etching burrs and still get uneven, rough and pitted lines. Perhaps it's a matter of practice but I also think technique, or my lack of it, has a lot to do with it."

You are on track with that line of thought. Practice, the right tools that have been sharpened appropriately and a growing sense of what each tool will do for you.

Could you start a new topic with a photo of a piece that shows the uneven, rough and pitted lines? I might be able to contribute some useful thoughts about this. I don't work in bone, but I do work in mammoth tusk. I'll even get out my piece of bone and see how my tools work, so that I have a better idea of what you are facing as you learn.

Janel

[Brent Duty]

Irishcarver, on Jun 15 2009, 10:09 PM, said:

Hey Paniolo,

Its been a while. I see that there is a new kiwi that has just joined on the forum. I sent him a message because he said he does lashings. Hopefully he'll be able to shed some light on the situation for us. I've started doing some lashings that create a knot on each side. I'll try and make a tutorial or something. Its pretty easy and looks well. I found artificial sinew in Michael's (craft store) and it is nice to work with. Its already waxed too and knots really nicely because it is flat and realy workable.
Got some antler today from a friend so that should be fun. Also got some soft stone but I cant think of the name right now.

Take care,

Damien

I started using that artificial sinew about a month ago and I love it. It looks so natural, the only draw back is it will stain a light colored shirt.
I've been meaning to get around to making a video of the knotted ridge since everyone is having so much trouble with it.

[Jaymes]

I have figured out how to do the knotted ridge lashing and am now trying to learn the more complex lashing that is going in more than one direction. I will post some photos of my work soon.

[Don Barnhill]

I buy my antler from a place called "Moscow hide and fur". I also use waxed thread for making knife sheaths.

Waxed thread and artificial sinew. http://www.tandyleatherfactory.com/home/de...avlocation=left

Here is the link to Moscow hide and fur. http://www.hideandfur.com/