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A question was asked about carving a dragon onto a blade. Here is a fairly nice dragon carved into a 17th cent. blade.
Dick
Horimono dragon
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Posted 03 June 2007 - 01:39 PM
Hi,
A question was asked about carving a dragon onto a blade. Here is a fairly nice dragon carved into a 17th cent. blade.
Dick
A question was asked about carving a dragon onto a blade. Here is a fairly nice dragon carved into a 17th cent. blade.
Dick
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Posted 03 June 2007 - 02:22 PM
Hey that's great, thanks for sharing
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Posted 04 June 2007 - 12:52 AM
Aloha Dick,
Cool dragon. This looks like the beginning of a thread for these creatures. Here's something I did last year. It's not carved, but is representational of traditional tansu hardware.
Karl
Cool dragon. This looks like the beginning of a thread for these creatures. Here's something I did last year. It's not carved, but is representational of traditional tansu hardware.
Karl
Accept what the fire gods give you. Serendipity is part of the process.
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Posted 04 June 2007 - 01:20 PM
Great stuff Karl....... I love dragons...!!!! 
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Posted 04 June 2007 - 03:02 PM
Hi Karl,
Here is a sword with a dragon I made for a bronze a few years ago. It is about 20" long. The piece is fabricated not cast.
Dick
Here is a sword with a dragon I made for a bronze a few years ago. It is about 20" long. The piece is fabricated not cast.
Dick
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Posted 04 June 2007 - 05:15 PM
Aloha Dick,
Whoa. Great dragons. How about a little more detail? Is it chased and repousse? High relief? All bronze? If so, how is bronze to work with? I'm working with an alloy with the intent of making mokume, but I'm guessing it will fight me.
Anybody else with dragons out there?
Karl
Whoa. Great dragons. How about a little more detail? Is it chased and repousse? High relief? All bronze? If so, how is bronze to work with? I'm working with an alloy with the intent of making mokume, but I'm guessing it will fight me.
Anybody else with dragons out there?
Karl
Accept what the fire gods give you. Serendipity is part of the process.
#7 Guest_ford hallam_*
Posted 04 June 2007 - 06:28 PM
Hi Karl,
I've got some dragons. give me a while and I'll get them online. If you've planning on using bronze in a mokume billet I'd simply advise you not to. It will be far too brittle to move with the other alloys, it'll simply tear apart.
If it's a particular colour contrast you are looking for perhaps I could suggest an alternative.
cheers, Ford
You may already know of Steve Midgett but if not his site is a great mokume haven, his book and video are very good too. Here's a link
The other book I would recommend is by Ian Furguson, Ian was at the Royal College in London and has taken Mokume into the 21st Century. His approach is very high tech but pretty amazing. Here's a link to his book.
I've got some dragons. give me a while and I'll get them online. If you've planning on using bronze in a mokume billet I'd simply advise you not to. It will be far too brittle to move with the other alloys, it'll simply tear apart.
If it's a particular colour contrast you are looking for perhaps I could suggest an alternative.cheers, Ford
You may already know of Steve Midgett but if not his site is a great mokume haven, his book and video are very good too. Here's a link
The other book I would recommend is by Ian Furguson, Ian was at the Royal College in London and has taken Mokume into the 21st Century. His approach is very high tech but pretty amazing. Here's a link to his book.
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Posted 04 June 2007 - 07:14 PM
ford hallam, on Jun 4 2007, 08:28 AM, said:
I've got some dragons.
Aloha Ford,
Sorry. Just sounds like you keep them out back in an aviary. Yes, I'm familiar with Midgett's and Ferguson's work as I do have their texts (some of the only contemporary publications). And I can ask the sensei, Gene. I have a really funny story concerning those three and how I met Gene, but this sounds like the makings of a new thread. Let's stay on the dragons here.
Karl
Accept what the fire gods give you. Serendipity is part of the process.
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Posted 04 June 2007 - 07:52 PM
Hi Karl,
The piece is created with layers of metal brazed and silver soldered together. It is then carved and chased. Here is the sketch I used to design my piece. The dragon on the left is what I used to cut out my pieces. If you check TCP post #1 in tutorials (Medal) you can see the technique. It works very well.
Dick
The piece is created with layers of metal brazed and silver soldered together. It is then carved and chased. Here is the sketch I used to design my piece. The dragon on the left is what I used to cut out my pieces. If you check TCP post #1 in tutorials (Medal) you can see the technique. It works very well.
Dick
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Posted 04 June 2007 - 08:26 PM
I have a copper dragon made by a friend of mines several years ago. it was done on copper sheet with chasing tools and a block of pitch.
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Posted 05 June 2007 - 02:00 AM
Aloha Dick,
Thanks. Should have recalled the very first tutorial.
Another question: how do you deal with such a large heat sink?
Ford
Belated thanks for the advice. Ferguson's chart back's you up. When we get a chance to start up a mokume thread, I have some ideas to kick around.
Dan
Another great dragon. Looks like it's been handled some. Ever thought of trying patination?
Karl
Thanks. Should have recalled the very first tutorial.
Another question: how do you deal with such a large heat sink?Ford
Belated thanks for the advice. Ferguson's chart back's you up. When we get a chance to start up a mokume thread, I have some ideas to kick around.
Dan
Another great dragon. Looks like it's been handled some. Ever thought of trying patination?
Karl
Accept what the fire gods give you. Serendipity is part of the process.
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Posted 05 June 2007 - 11:52 AM
Karl Carvalho, on Jun 4 2007, 07:15 PM, said:
...how is bronze to work with? I'm working with an alloy with the intent of making mokume, but I'm guessing it will fight me.
Anybody else with dragons out there?
Karl
Anybody else with dragons out there?
Karl
Hi Karl,
Bronze is more a general term for mainly copper- tin alloys.
When working with bronze it depends on the tin content how the working abilitys of the alloy is. Everything above 5% Tin is too brittle for forging.
I had made mokume with bronze-copper. It was made with very low tin bronze- it looks almost like copper when unpatinated and has exellent bonding abilitys. When patinated with rokusho the colour contrast is rather subtile.
Maybe more next time on a mokume tread...
regards
Karl
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Posted 05 June 2007 - 03:03 PM
Karl Carvalho, on Jun 4 2007, 01:15 PM, said:
If so, how is bronze to work with? I'm working with an alloy with the intent of making mokume, but I'm guessing it will fight me.
Karl
Karl
Aloha Karl,
My friend Mark Morgan worked extensively with bronze mokume in the 80s and early 90s. I'll attach a photo of a raised vessel that he gave me around 1990. He worked at school with Gene and Hiroko. Unfortunately I don't know the alloys in this piece, but they are bronze. The patina has changed since Mark gave it to me(age and a smokey house fire
) The rim is Sterling. 4" tall .Mark was a member of TCP at one point, I think, but I can't seem to locate him. At that time he had as much practical experience with alloys as anyone I know outside of Japan.Obviously as with any material one must know ones materials and their limits. As with all things alloy, atmosphere is key. Mark obviously was working from a background of extensive experience, perserverence, and vision. He also enameled over bronze mokume, which in most circles would be considered folly.
Good luck. Aloha no, Jim
Attached image(s)
#14 Guest_ford hallam_*
Posted 05 June 2007 - 03:55 PM
Hi Jim,
I'd guess that the alloy your friend used was probably a silicon bronze ( 3% Si ) they can be forged and rolled etc. Personally though, I've never liked the colours that they exhibit after traditional patination.
Cheers, Ford
I'd guess that the alloy your friend used was probably a silicon bronze ( 3% Si ) they can be forged and rolled etc. Personally though, I've never liked the colours that they exhibit after traditional patination.
Cheers, Ford
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Posted 05 June 2007 - 04:52 PM
Aloha
Thanks for the replies guys. We have got to get a mokume thread going.
Jim
Good to hear from you. Thanks for the image. I'll be seeing Gene soon, so I will ask about Mark. It would be great if we could get him back.
About the dragons, I have two questions.
1) Why do some have three claws, and some have five?
2) Dan's had 4 orbs of knowledge (is that the term?). My reference had one. What are they about?
Karl
Thanks for the replies guys. We have got to get a mokume thread going.
Jim
Good to hear from you. Thanks for the image. I'll be seeing Gene soon, so I will ask about Mark. It would be great if we could get him back.
About the dragons, I have two questions.
1) Why do some have three claws, and some have five?
2) Dan's had 4 orbs of knowledge (is that the term?). My reference had one. What are they about?
Karl
Accept what the fire gods give you. Serendipity is part of the process.
#16 Guest_ford hallam_*
Posted 05 June 2007 - 06:29 PM
Hi Karl,
apologies for the delay in rounding up my dragons, they're a slippery lot!
Generally speaking, Japanese dragons have 3 claws, occasionally 4. Chinese Imperial dragons always have 5, in fact is was an offence for anyone but the Emperor to display a 5 clawed dragon. Japanese artists have never been too observant of these "rules" though so you will occasionally see exceptions. The single jewel ( a flawless crystal ball ) held by Japanese dragons represents one of the three emblems of the Japanese Imperial regalia. The other 2 being the sword and the mirror.
regards, Ford
apologies for the delay in rounding up my dragons, they're a slippery lot!
Generally speaking, Japanese dragons have 3 claws, occasionally 4. Chinese Imperial dragons always have 5, in fact is was an offence for anyone but the Emperor to display a 5 clawed dragon. Japanese artists have never been too observant of these "rules" though so you will occasionally see exceptions. The single jewel ( a flawless crystal ball ) held by Japanese dragons represents one of the three emblems of the Japanese Imperial regalia. The other 2 being the sword and the mirror.
regards, Ford
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Posted 05 June 2007 - 06:48 PM
The dragon i posted was made by a Tibetan metalsmith,i do not know the reason for the 4 orbs though. a mokume thread might be interesting ,there is a yahoo mokume group with James Binnion as a moderator. it has had few questions for a while.
#18 Guest_ford hallam_*
Posted 05 June 2007 - 09:07 PM
As far as mokume gane goes, I reckon if you've got Steve Midgett's book and video, and Ian Furgusons book then you probably have all you need. If you can't get it to "happen" for you with that load of expertise and experience then I'd suggest taking up origami instead.
cheers, Ford
Hi Karl,
I should have added with my comment about bronze that I was considering it in combination with the usual Japanese alloys and copper. I spent a little time with Ian trying to figure out ways of applying traditional patinating processes to his very avant garde combinations, predictably, nothing really worked very well.
The other thing to consider is the very "high tech'" approach needed to create those combinations.
Ford
cheers, Ford
Hi Karl,
I should have added with my comment about bronze that I was considering it in combination with the usual Japanese alloys and copper. I spent a little time with Ian trying to figure out ways of applying traditional patinating processes to his very avant garde combinations, predictably, nothing really worked very well.
The other thing to consider is the very "high tech'" approach needed to create those combinations.
Ford
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Posted 05 June 2007 - 10:22 PM
ford hallam, on Jun 5 2007, 11:07 AM, said:
then I'd suggest taking up origami instead.
Aloha Ford,
Been there. Done that. I'm 1/2 Japanese, so I folded 250 cranes for my wedding.
I've made the easier copper/copper alloy/silver laminates, so I am up for a challenge. Why not go where few have gone before?
Dan
I've checked out that site from time to time. Very slow. I think we are cooler.
Hey, I started the thread next door. Let's continue there and let the dragons have their lair.
Karl
Accept what the fire gods give you. Serendipity is part of the process.
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Posted 06 June 2007 - 10:04 PM
Hi all,
While on the subject of dragons, I just thought I would post these photos for the ironworkers out there. This is one of two seats bordering a fireplace, and was made by Paul Beau, a Montreal based artist, around 1925. It is all forged iron. Coincidentally, I just took these photos last week.
While on the subject of dragons, I just thought I would post these photos for the ironworkers out there. This is one of two seats bordering a fireplace, and was made by Paul Beau, a Montreal based artist, around 1925. It is all forged iron. Coincidentally, I just took these photos last week.
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