How is it possible

[Phil White]

I'm not sure how these reproduction facilities work, but I suspect that it resembles somewhat the traditional system, where carvers and their aptitude were/are very much a product of their environment.

 

There was/is a heirarchy, with the master carver/sculptor at the top, who usually did most of the design work, made models to be copied by the carvers, and usually did some of the more complicated work, such as faces and hands. The master usually owned the studio and signed his/her name to the work. A carver would be hired as an apprentice, or essentially a laborer, then learn the trade from the ground up, according to his or her aptitude. He/she may become a master, or they may stop at joinery, or they may be content to be a carver who copies the models produced by the master, never making the leap to designer.

 

I believe that what makes a carver who copies the designs or models of others into a sculptor is not only the aptitude for design, but the desire and drive to express his/herself and create something original. Therefore, I see no reason why these carvers shouldn't become atrists in their own right, provided that they have the drive to do so.

 

I was discussing this issue with a friend of mine this weekend, in a slightly different context. In my situation, my studio used to have just such a heirarchy. Recently there has been quite a bit of discussion regarding the potential hiring of a carver to work with me, and/or potentially another person who could have the aptitude to take over for me when I eventually retire in 15 years or so. The big question that I will have to face when hiring, and in the long term, will be is the person capable of creating good original work, or will they remain a competant carver. Will I look for someone just out of school who is open to new ideas, or a more experienced carver who could be set in their ways. But I digress.

 

Phil

[Guest Clive]

About ten years ago when a certain Japanese netsuke carver ran a school for netsuke carving (no names) it was quite remarkable how his students actually made carvings very much in the style of their tutor. He had a very distinct style.. a certain way of describing form that would be "copied" quite faithfully even when the students where creating their own designs.

 

I remember thinking at the time how very strange that approach seemed to my Western mind.. I think I'd be very alarmed if anybody I was helping started making little clives.

 

but then again.. artist workshops used to operate like this in Europe only a couple of hundred years ago before the rise of the individual, some might even say the cult of the individual. In that context I wonder if the same cultural change would be possible in the far east.

[fkvesic]

Copies v. originals? I dunno. I suppose there's a value in some copies if you're learning, but any good teacher/master will encourage originality, provided that the basics are well learned along the way. I can't see that happening in a H/K sweat-shop atmosphere, but can see it happening in a good apprenticeship scheme where the master's on the lookout for students who are slavish copyists and weans them away from the tendency.

 

On the other hand, an atelier system also ensures that students learn, but doesn't, for financial reasons, encourage individuality.

 

Can good carvers in the Far East make the transition to artist status? I see no reason why not, in theory: the reality is, though, that many of them just want to earn a living and are being paid pennies to produce enough stuff to ensure a minimal livelihood. It'd be a big risk for many of them to go solo, though humans being what they are, I'm sure at least some of them will.

[Guest Clive]

In the old netsuke workshops carvers pay was related to the weight of ivory since most of the retailers of finished netsuke where the guys that actually imported the ivory. They would give X weight of ivory to a carving shop who would turn it into netsuke, renumeration being largely based on weight of ivory wasted in the carving process. You can see how system figured in the design of many antique pieces yet it did encouraged carvers to seek origanal ways to get the most out of the material.

The most successful carvers were rewarded better and this gave some the opportunity to create carving workshops of their own.

[Doug Sanders]

It may be a red herring, but the yi-xing teapots of China might be a good example of factory hand-made pieces and one-off masterpieces coexisting. Artists working years at a high-production facility and then branching out on their own. The trouble with netsuke is that it's not an indigenous craft in China, strictly speaking (nor is it for us in the West either!), so we struggle with its qualities and seek analogs in our own traditions. The Chinese stuff will always look Chinese- I don't have a problem with that- but I want the pieces to be a bit more artistically honest. I'm not talking about copies and forgeries- but inherently true to the carver.

[Guest Clive]

... and then there's Kizaemon Tea-Bowl, regarded by some as the finest ever made. Made in Korea in the 16th Century it came off a peasant potters wheel probably just one of thousands that the craftsmen churned out in his lifetime. Could such a beauty ever be consciously created?

[Dick Bonham]

Hi,

Just a slightly off the track remark about Chinese production artists. A year or so ago I was shopping at the local Mall and there was a Chinese artist doing pastel portraits. The portraits were some of the finest work I have ever seen and the artist could do a piece in about fifteen minutes. A full color detailed portrait that was a dead ringer of the person sitting. He couldn't speak English but had a translator so I was able to talk to him when he wasn't working. He had been a production painter doing various parts of paintings on an assembly line. He had a chance to move to the US and brought his talent here. I think we would be surprised at the number of very fine artists that are working on a production line in China.

Dick

 

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